‘m sort of sorry I’ve been away so long. I would have liked to lower the tenor of comments here.

So I’ll do it this way … this thread is officially CLOSED. Let’s move on.

Geoff

There you go again, reading INTO what I say instead of reading WHAT I had to say.

I did NOT call you to task. I tried to help provide clarification to combat general misconceptions that are out there. Not YOUR misconceptions. GENERAL misconceptions.

Apparenly I made a mistake in citing those misconceptions without noting their source. I assumed that since you’ve interacted in this thread, that you’d read it as well and would connect the dots. Apparently that was a poor assumption.

So… let me try to connect the dots for you:

– Micah related the experience (comment #20) of someone with a misconception of Journey… specifically that the own a bar and host worship there.

– SelahV (comment #26) refers to Theology at the Bottleworks as a Bible study in a bar, and asks a few questions about it.

In comes my first attempt to provide clarification… #30. I directed our friend SelahV to Journey’s website so that she could see how they currently portray things. I also noted that it’s a bit of a misconception to call it a “Bible study in a bar”.

So we continue with further statements indicating misconceptions…

– David (comment #35) noted that he’d heard they were meeting for worship in a bar, and were drinking during the Bible study.

– You noted you didn’t know the exact verbiage, and relayed it as “bring your bible and grab a brew” (comment #47, #51).

So… that brings us to my comments in #55, where I tried to help correct some of these misconceptions once again, this time by providing the exact text they used on their website at the start of this controversy and a Baptist Press link. Perhaps I should not have interjected additional commentary at that point further expressing my frustrations. Perhaps you focused on that rather than my initial point.

Regardless, we see how my attempts to combat misconception went, as you responded to Geoff in #65, in response to his usage of my comment (#55) to bring clarification to David in #59.

Apparently, at that point, you assumed that both Geoff and I were trying to malign you. I don’t see how you came to this conclusion, but it doesn’t really matter now… damage done. Geoff reiterated to you that was not his intent in #67, and I did similarly in #78.

Anyway, I’ll reiterate one last time… I thought my purpose all throughout this had been clear… to try to help clear up some of the many misconceptions that are out there and continue to be out there.

If you can’t take me at my word about my purpose to clarify, that my intent is certainly not to malign you, that I have no intent to point out error in you, and that I have no intent to assign anything negative to you, I guess we really are just wasting our time here.

As for me? I think I’m going to crawl back into that hole in which I normally reside in Baptist blog land over at my own little low-traffic, non-controversial site. I’ve realized once again today why I don’t interact online on Baptist matters very often anymore… it’s simply a waste of my time and energy.

“I will remain in the world no longer, but THEY ARE STILL IN THE WORLD, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name — the name you gave me — SO THAT THEY MAY BE ONE AS WE ARE ONE. While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe by the name you gave me. NONE HAS BEEN LOST except the one doomed to destruction so that Scripture would be fulfilled” (John 17:11-12).

Unless someone is a Judas and is “doomed to destruction” we should grieve whenever disunity mars the community and any of the fold is “lost” for whatever reason. (In fact, we should grieve whenever one of ours is “doomed for destruction.”) It should never be our desire or goal that someone leave. Instead, among God’s people “unity” should be the goal. Whenever we don’t have it, it affects our witness. After all, a lost world is watching us (vv. 21, 23).

Here you go again. I have not stated that the church owns a bar. I have not stated that the church is hosting a worship service in the bar. I have stated that the church is having a bible study in the bar and that the church originally advertised that the bible study was open to anyone that wanted to come. The website–THE CHURCH OWNED–advertised the promotion of the beverage alcohol. That is all that I have said or promoted. You called me to task because of words that I used and you said; “A quick correction… The Journey’s website originally said “grab a brew, share your view”, in regard to Theology at the Bottleworks, not “bring your Bible, grab a brew”.” If you would have read the entire comment in #47 you would have seen that I said I did not know what the correct verbiage was. That is the only task I took to you. Yours, along with Brother Geoff’s comment in #59 gives me the appearance that I am wrong on my quote, thus I am spreading error on everything else.

All I am trying to say is that this situation is not without blame all around. For Brother Patrick and the others involved in Acts 29 there in Missouri to be surprised that this is happening would be like Britney Spears mom to be surprised that her 16 year old daughter is pregnant. According to things in her life she should not be surprised. According to the way the MBC has been moving this should not be such a huge surprise.

Blessings,
Tim

If you think I’m trying to bash you for something you said, paint you as a liar, or anything else negative, you’re sorely mistaken.

All I tried to do was provide the exact verbiage that was listed on their website, as documented by Baptist Press coverage of the issue, in an attempt to correct any further misconceptions about Journey’s “outreach” (if you want to call it that). They have clearly identified on their website that “Theology at the Bottleworks” is part of what they call “Midrash”, a ministry intended simply to engage culture, discuss ideas, etc., in an effort to connect with people.

The fact that there are STILL people out there that think that the church owns a bar and is hosting worship service in it, that they are holding “a Bible study in a bar”, or any number of other misconceptions about the program they call “Theology at the Bottleworks” tells me that attempts to clarify are simply an exercise in futility.

I still don’t understand why some people can’t seem to take Darrin at his word… that their web design company put something up on the site he was not aware of, that it mistaken characterized what they were about and what they were trying to accomplish, and that they corrected the issue when they became aware of it and considered it a lesson learned.

And this is all a rabbit trail away from the main discussion… MBC actions to remove funding from Acts 29 church planters.

*SIGH*